Pan’s Rebuilt Engine

Discussion in 'Mech Tech' started by PanZer, Jan 16, 2021.

  1. Does that come across?

    Y’all made me this way.
    Got it in my head that i’ll turn the key and find a puddle of melted metal out the back that doesn’t at least have the courtesy to morph in to an assassin robot.


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  2. Most unlikely to happen ;)
     
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  3. mikedjames

    mikedjames Supporter

    You have seem to have a freeway flier transmission with 3800 RPM at 70 MPH. That means the cooling fan has not reached its maximum cooling throughput by 70MPH..
    The max cooling of the T1 fan with stock pulleys is at about 4000 RPM.

    Cooling peaks about 4500 RPM for the superior T4 fan which shifts a lot more air.

    So the same problem on my bus - at 68mph around 3800 ish RPM it runs cool, at an indicated 75mph (68 actual), 4100 RPM it starts to warm up - stock transmission , 5% undersize tyres gives this.

    The main thing with protecting a larger engine is watching the cylinder heads as the head temperatures and around the valves get closest to the softening point of the aluminium in normal use.

    If you drive it like stock but only with short bursts of power - hill climb on a motorway then level off, shouldnt be an issue, but my bus really notices the gradual long climb east to Membury Services on the M4, reaching highest oil and cylinder head temperatures as you switch off in the services (not good).

    Three miles at 30mph and all the temperatures are good.
     
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  4. You’ve touched on many things there.
    Looking at the Freeway Flyer info my mph/rpm do seem to closely match; on 185R 15C 8PR tyres all round.
    Maybe that transmission isn’t so bad on my larger engine.

    A ‘best cooling strategy’ is something i’ve thought about - like your 30mph 3mile cool down. Thing is, you can’t always control that, like the 70mph motorway to sudden crawling in traffic.

    Would it be a bad idea to drop down a gear to raise the rpm to closer to optimum fan cooling speed? Or does that introduce excessive wear?

    It was reading about your Membury Services hill climb EGT readings that led me to looking in to those gauges. So we are full-circle to why I want to monitor as much as I can - within the realms of not being obsessive!


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  5. [​IMG]

    Not my future review mirror scenario then.


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  6. Zed

    Zed Gradually getting grumpier

    CHT is great, on a long motorway hill I can alternate between maintaining speed or accelerating and see the difference I can also see the temp go down if I let it slow a little as I go up the gradient.* This can be a good tactic for overheating buses - take a run up and let some speed bleed off as you go up the gradient. It'll probably be slowing down even with your foot to the floor anyway so letting it slow slightly more is no great loss but a real plus to head heat.

    * I now have the only engine I've ever had that I can't make overheat and I've had 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10 engines over the years stock and otherwise, all sizes. It's a mystery as technically there is so much wrong with it's non-stock design. Probably that it's so underpowered for it's size, I can't think of anything else. It's a difficult mental journey to say "no thanks" to 50-60 more peak HP in exchange for some low end grunt but the cool running is pleasant unexpected benefit if that is in fact the cause.
     
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  7. That right there is the idea - drive to the gauges rather than solely desire. I’ll have the power and speed when I need, and can use it sensibly informed. Longevity aspect to consider too by not driving to its limits too much.

    The soul destroying shame of the engine seizing (finances aside) was that it was great! Seemingly no issues with it. I could overtake uphill if needed.
    The engine builder said the new incarnation will perform similarly, with a bit more low-end torque at the loss of some high-end.

    We talked about how I like to drive and my mph/rpm notes. He said I wasn’t revving the hell out of it so the engine will suit me.

    On asking about the heat issue he said it will be fine, but will always run hotter than a smaller engine:
    “I wouldn’t have built it if I thought was going to be no good.” Words to that effect.


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  8. @PanZer the old engine didn't overheat, so I don't see how an 'improved' one of the same size would.
    Drive it, enjoy it.
    See what the gauges you decide to fit tell you and then take it from there in terms of more new gauges, external cooler etc etc
     
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  9. stirlingmoz

    stirlingmoz Supporter

    Last edited: Jan 19, 2021
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  10. stirlingmoz

    stirlingmoz Supporter

  11. Stock camshaft reground to Engle 100 spec.

    He uses machinists he has known for years who work on F1 stuff - so he is confident with the work that they do.


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  12. Zed

    Zed Gradually getting grumpier

    Didn't it? I thought it seized.

    Driving a T1 engined bus at the speeds quoted earlier certainly made be wonder. 65-70mph is living on the edge if that's true sat nav speed. I've never been able to do that, I had to go type-4 to drive at sustained high speed and maintain it uphill.

    My speedo is very accurate up to around 60mph, after that it drifts out over reading more and more so to go 70mph on sat nav I'm at 75mph on the speedo. 65-70mph speedo would really be 63-67 or something like that.
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2021
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  13. Nice find. I only saw one from the other side of the Atlantic!

    [mention]snotty [/mention] that’s the piece right. “Remanufactured”. Not entirely sure what that actually means - peace of rubbish painted.
    If it looks like it won’t fall apart i’ll get it.


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  14. 77 Westy

    77 Westy Supporter

    An Engle 100 has a little more duration compared to the Scat C25 that I use, the CR is okay for the cam so it’s looking good. What ratio are the rockers you’re using?
     
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  15. Seized through lack of oil if i remember correctly.

    The full flow oil pipes were removed, turning it fro full flow to no flow!
     
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  16. Looks ok. Pricey, tho'

    Could actually make your own.

    http://type2.com/rvanness/sealfram.htm
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2021
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  17. did megabug manage to unearth anything from their second hand supplies? or VW fbi
     
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  18. The speedo on this Bay is the only one i’ve ever had on a vehicle that’s almost 100% accurate to SatNav.

    PO told me it would do 80mph, so I thought i’d check. Only did that a couple of times to know that it could. Straight line late at night on a motorway. Steering felt light though.
    It would sit very happily at 70mph. Very solid.
    I was driving ignorant of the vehicle then though - like a guy who bought a Doberman not knowing it shouldn’t be treated like a Labrador.

    I drove a friend’s old ambulance from London to Preston and that was frightening at 55mph.

    The seizure was a complete lack of oil flow. I still don’t know enough to understand exactly what did and didn’t happen. It’s all been a whirlwind ever since.


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  19. “Ok” is good enough for me.
    I’m having to re-make 80% of the campervan so i’ll cheat on a £30 part. I’m very slow at everything...probably would cost me double that in time alone.


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  20. Yes, i’d read your preference for the Scat, so I was nervous of your thoughts!
    Ah, you’ve got me on “rockers”. I’ve no idea (other than they have covers) what they are even. I’ll find out.


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